Reversing the aging disease – Dr Caroline Leaf series

In this video

[Music] hi I’m dr. Caroline leaf and welcome to cleaning up the mental mess a podcast where each week I discuss practical simple and scientifically back ways to help you take back control of your mental health help others and ultimately love your happiest life in this episode I am interviewing dr. Stephen gondry dr. Stephen Gundry is a cardiothoracic surgeon and director and founder of the International heart and lung Institute as well as the Center for restorative medicine in Palm Springs and Santa Barbara California dr. Gundry is passionate about teaching people how to avoid surgery by using his unique vision of human nutrition his mission is to improve people’s health happiness and longevity by making simple changes to their diets he is also a four-time New York Times bestselling author and a leading expert on the lectin free diet as the key to reversing disease and increasing longevity which he explains in his book the plant paradox and in his newest book the longevity paradox where he shares the secrets on how to live your best longest life in this episode dr. gondry and I discuss his fascinating research and unique opinions on how certain foods affect our bodies and longevity overall why we may be living longer but we’re not living better how our bacteria control our behavior and bodies the plant paradox and how some vegetables could be hurting us how gut health and mental health are directly linked and how to optimize gut house dr.

Condry also gives advice on what to feed your children and how some everyday foods are linked to childhood heart problems and how to develop healthy habits in children just before we start I want to thank everyone again who has left a review subscribed to this podcast and shaded on social media and with friends and family not only does your feedback help me improve each episode but I really love seeing you what you guys are learning and what key takeaways you have it’s so encouraging and exciting and if you enjoy today’s podcast please consider leaving a five star review this information in this podcast is free all our ask is that you share and subscribe one will note before we begin this interview was recorded remotely so the audio quality may be a little scratchy in some areas now back to today’s episode dr. Guthrie it is such an honor to have you on my show I really I love your work and I’ve been following you for a while and I’ve got your books and I’d love you to share a little bit more about you that’s not in your bio and what got you where you are today why you do what you do and just a huge welcome to have you on my podcast thanks so much for having me I don’t know what do you want to know that people don’t know about me well you can give you a broad overview and then you see some you know something else you’d like to add I think a couple of interesting things I add back in the dark ages at Yale University as an undergraduate I had a four year research project on human evolutionary biology where I tried to argue that you could take a great ape manipulate its food supply and manipulate its environment and prove that you would arrive at a human being and I actually defended my thesis and then gave it to my parents and went off to become a very famous heart surgeon and story yeah and kind of forgot all about it until I was chairman and professor of cardiothoracic surgery at Loma Linda University in Southern California and pioneered with my partner Leonard Bailey baby and infant heart transplants and came very famous for taking on very difficult cases and so my life was really changed in the late 90s by meeting a gentleman I call bigad who had inoperable coronary artery disease big Edie had been on a diet for six months before he saw me and had lost 45 pounds and he had gone to a health food store and was taking a bunch of supplements which I thought made expensive urine back then lo and behold this guy in six months time cleaned out 58% of inoperable coronary artery blockages and I’d never seen anything like that and I see it all the time now but I said gee you know tell me all about this diet and he starts rambling off this diet and I go wait a minute flashback this was actually the diet I described in my research project Wow so many years ago and I called my parents who lived in San Diego at the time and I said hey do you you know do you still have my thesis a big thick tome they said oh yeah we’ve got it and I said well send it up and it’s actually sitting in my office I’m staring at it right now oh wow so I was a I was a big fat guy even though I was a famous heart surgeon that’s kind of dumb and running 30 miles a week going in the gym one hour a day and eating a healthy low-fat mostly vegetarian diet and so I put myself on this program and I lost 50 pounds my first year and lost another goodness lost another 20 pounds subsequently and I’ve kept it off for over 20 years my goodness so cut the chase I started putting the patients I operated on on this program to keep them away from me subsequently and then after a year of doing this and watching the changes in people’s lives I made a really horrible mistake and said I’ve I’m doing this all wrong I shouldn’t operate on people first and then teach them how to eat I should teach them how to eat and maybe I won’t have to operate on them now as a heart surgeon that’s really stupid and as my wife likes to remind me through the years but I designed my position at the top of my game and set up a clinic in Palm Springs where I asked people to take certain foods out of their diet and go get some supplements a Costco or tray josè there wasn’t an Amazon back then and every three months I’d draw blood on them to see what was happening and kind of the rest is history and we saw patterns that were reproducible and wrote a bunch of best-selling books since that time and now I have two clinics one in Palm Springs and one in Santa Barbara and I see patients actually 6 days a week even Saturdays and Sundays that’s incredible still do so that’s incredible you must love what you do to be working 7 days a week with six days a week yeah well yeah the other day I’m actually at Gundry MD my supplement company and making new fun formulas based actually on the research that I do in my patients yeah I love what I do I’m like a kid in a candy store and you know kind of every day I get to see what I would have called miracles long ago or just unbelievable things but now so I keep working because every day I get to I learn something from a patient virtually every day and so much of my research was prompted by a patient asking me a question I didn’t have an answer for or asking me about a supplement that I had never heard of and I would try it on myself first and find out you know what the effect would be so there you go that’s an incredible story and you know it’s very inspiring when a doctor actually is driven by the patient as opposed to the doctor telling the patient what to do which obviously that Rajasa need to do but you’re responding to the patients need and listening to the patient story I mean who knows it sells better than the person so that’s very very inspiring I love that and I love your mission teach people how to avoid surgery by using your unique vision of human nutrition so can you share a bit more about what this is and what this unique vision is that you discovered quite a few years back well one of the things that was interesting about my research at Yale we evolved from the line of apes and we are a great ape and we were primarily forest dwelling leaf eating fruit eating animals and we were exposed to plant compounds as all animals are that contain what are called lectins and lectins are primarily plant proteins that are designed by the plant as a defense system against B and early on we have to realize that plants were not put here on earth as food for animals they erected here first and when insects arrived plants had a problem because they couldn’t run hide fight but they were chemists have incredible ability so they use chemical biological warfare to make animals think twice about eating them and what I got interested in was these plant proteins that are called lectins when we have a very good defense system against plant lectins we have a phenomenal microbiome that believe it or not is very adept at eating lectins we have wonderful stomach acid which breaks down proteins and we have a mucus layer lining our GI tract and lining our mouth and nose that sorbs lectins and so we had a pretty good system going on now fast-forward to ten thousand years ago when we began for the first time eating grains and beans which we’re quite frankly lethal unless cooked because of their lectin content and while it’s true that grains and beans made us what we are today and certainly allowed for civilization as we know it to happen nevertheless we paid a price beginning 10,000 years ago we actually shrunk dramatically our brain size decreased 15% over what it was 10,000 years ago so I documented that in my researched and long ago and when I started taking these modern foods away from people and having them eat I like to joke that we should party like it’s 9999 years ago like a riffle princes old song yeah most of the diseases that we assume are you know going to happen to us actually go away we also take away foods that are even more modern and one of the things since you’re originally from Africa all of us in the United States are not from the United States or originally we were all European African or Asian and so none of us except for Native Americans who were actually Asian we’re exposed to North and South American plants until five hundred years ago when Columbus started trade and some of our most beloved foods like peanuts cashews tomatoes eggplant peppers potatoes quinoa are actually American plants that have lectins that were not used to so we take these foods away from people we find that whatever they came in with whether it was pain whether it was depression where there was anxiety whether it was an autoimmune disease where there was coronary arteries where there was diabetes these go away and if you continue on this path they stay away this episode is sponsored by made one of my favorite CBD companies Nets full spectrum hemp oil products contained CBD extracted from the finest organic hemp plants Nate offers many different products including a collection for balancing hormones and helping ease period pains I personally have found their products to be a great addition to my mental self-care routine they full-spectrum hemp oils helped me sleep better all the sleep fast and just feel overall much net products are non-gmo a great source of antioxidants can help reduce inflammation and pain and will not get you high Thank You Ned for supporting the show you can get 15% off today with free shipping by going to Eve and use the code doctor leaf dr l e AF the link will also be in the show notes what are some of the major health issues that people come to us and is there a growing trend that we should be concerned about and I think I know your answer from what you just told me but I’d love to hear you you know speak to that well about 70% of my patients now come to see me with an autoimmune disease or multiple automatic Muniz eases that they’ve been kind of everywhere including five or seven University centers without getting to the root cause of the problem and what we do is I mean just backtrack for a second Hippocrates 2500 years ago said that all disease begins and the gut and what we’ve learned is he’s right all disease begins in the gut and autoimmune disease is just a manifestation of leaky gut and when we seal the gut and stop it leaking then these diseases go away what’s fascinating is lectins were designed by plants to create leak gut that’s actually how they do their mischief and when people say well there’s lots of gut restoring protocols out there and there’s lots of leaky gut protocols out there and that’s true what I like to tell people and I guess I convinced quite a few of them that let’s suppose you and I are out on a rowboat you know lake and we spring a leak in the bottom of our boat and water starts coming into them boat we have two choices the one we have a glass or a bucket in the moat we can start bailing and we can throw the water over the side and hopefully if the hole is small enough we can keep up with it but if the hole gets bigger we need a bigger bucket and we have to bail faster so most of the gut healing protocols are actually giving people buckets Wow the other hand it’s a whole lot easier to plug the hole with your finger or whatever duct tape and then the water stops coming in so if lectins are one of the major causes of the holes then getting lectins out of the diet plugs the holes and that’s all you gotta do wow that’s incredibly simple actually quite but if the paradigm shift for most people I think isn’t it right yeah really you know simple solutions are always the best and the more complex you make things and the more complex you try to make things you’re usually looking at the wrong answer that’s very good that’s very wise and disrelated to that question gut else in the microbiome and as everyone’s talking about it now I see that you do talk about probiotics and prebiotics and how would that link in with controlling Leighton’s in your diet well again long ago we had we’re supposed to have greater than 10,000 different species of bacteria and fungi and viruses in our gut this is a complex ecosystem like a tropical rainforest that tropical rainforest is very adept at being not only good at eating lectins but also communicating to our immune system that they’ve got our back that they can handle just about anything that the world is going to throw down our gut and that the immune system can kind of relax and go have a doughnut and a smoke and you know don’t worry about what happened to most of us particularly in North America and now increasingly in the world we’ve decimated this ecosystem this rainforest with antibiotics that we’re given or we take with antibiotics that are fed to our animals to make them grow fatter and bigger quicker and so we’ve pretty much destroyed this wonderful tropical rainforest and I go into in all my books the other seven deadly disruptors which for instance so people don’t realize that swallowing and ibuprofen is literally like swallowing a hand grenade and that will blow holes in your gut Wow yeah so that’s kind of what happened so probiotics which are if you will friendly bacteria most people don’t realize that most of the probiotics we swallow never make it past gastric acid dead bacteria do have some usefulness and we can definitely measure that utility prebiotics on the other hand or what friendly bacteria need to eat to grow and one of the things that I try to convince all of my patients is that I’d much rather you eat or take prebiotics than probiotics I use the example here in Palm Springs which is a desert if I sold you grass seed which is a if you will a probiotic it’s a seed and you come back a month later and you’d say you sold me bad grass seed it didn’t grow and I said what what do you mean and they said well we you know we sprinkled it out on the desert and it didn’t grow it’s bad grassy I said well did you water it did you fertilizer well no you didn’t tell me – well it’s not gonna grow unless you you know water it and fertilize it and that’s most of the problem that people make they might have bacteria or they swallow a bunch of probiotics but that don’t give the bacteria the things they need to eat to actually seal your gut and so much of my next to last book which was a longevity paradox is a deep dive into this secret foods if you will that good bacteria need to keep you around for a very very long time okay so let’s talk about that because that’s what I’m really excited to get into as well is that so the longevity paradox is the name of the book how to die young at a ripe old age I love that subtitle and in the book you mentioned most of us assume that aging means living with declining health including prescription drugs and disease and chronic pain so while we may be living longer you’re not necessarily living better and that’s the paradox of aging and you also talk a bit about the disease of aging and you share groundbreaking plan for living a long healthy and happy life I love this book and can you talk about this book and continue the discussion that you just began in the previous question that laid into this book well most of us want to live a long time but at the same time and the paradox is most of us don’t want to get old we look at what’s happening to family members loved ones or friends and it doesn’t look very good getting old it means you know bypass surgery your stance or everything hip or knee replacements or the worst scenario is living in assisted living and not you know remembering your loved ones names or even your spouse’s name and that doesn’t seem appealing what’s important to realize is that that’s actually not our fate it’s not the fate of people who live in blue zones which and Prettner the journalist described and interestingly enough I’m the only nutritionist who has actually ever spent most of his career in a blue zone a la mode oh wow that’s amazing hello Melinda is the only blue zone in the United States so what the secret is is that the more diverse our microbiome the more friendly bacteria we have in our gut or the interaction of those bacteria with the lining of our gut and the more that lining is intact and the more really cool bioactive compounds of just name one that we talked a lot about in the book called butyrate not only the longer you’re going to live but the better you’re going to live longer and if anybody uses the argument well we’re living longer and each year we live longer and longer and longer so that’s great it turns out that the last three years in a row our longevity has declined exactly I’m so glad you brought that up I was about to actually ask you because I said trained as you know it’s not happening anymore the Train does reverse oh yeah and you know there’s some pretty good evidence that you know I’m a baby boomer but my daughters who are Gen Xers will if they don’t change and thank goodness both of my daughter’s changed they will have shorter lives than the baby boomers and that’s pretty doggone scary and and again it’s already happening three years in a row now our lifespan has decreased rather than increase and they even I don’t know if you saw I’m sure you would you’ve obviously read the research but they started getting indications of this back in 96 and I know when I was started practicing in the mid 80s I already saw the shift in people’s diets and the shift in how people are you know shifting to medication shifting to the modern American diet all these things that you talk about I watch this and I watch the this moving forward and people the trillion moving backwards so you can’t keep messing with these things and expect no consequences I’m so glad you raised this point yeah you know the average American now takes seven prescription drugs and considers that normal it’s crazy yeah and as I unfortunately have learned sickness is really good for business here I get family practice residents that rotate through my clinic for a month in their third year before they go out into practice and number one none of them are exposed to what I call restorative medicine if you want to call it functional medicine that’s fine mm-hmm and every one of them has gone back to their counselor and say oh wow you know this is what I went into medicine to do this is you know this is what I thought was going to happen and you know I said I’m gonna do this and their counselors first and look at them we said are you crazy you have to see a patient every II you know five to ten minutes throughout the day you have to move 40 patients through your office every day to make a living and you can’t spend an hour with a new patient and you can’t spend a half an hour with a patient every three months that’s crazy you have to write prescriptions and that’s what you got to do and but unfortunately this is you know our system with a mental health I’ll be the self medical system has gone it’s just shocking but I think there is hope I think for instance folks like the Institute for functional medicine which is now you know actively involved and in training functional medicine practitioners I train people who want to rotate with me and restorative medicine so this hope it’s gonna be a very hard process though because big money is involved exactly that is making it a hard process but thank goodness for people like you and cynics like you and as you say these functional medicines taking a bit more ground at the moment and at least that new doctors are getting exposure to your kind of way of practicing medicine and your books are out there and you know that’s it that does as you say provide hope yeah my the plant paradox has been translated into 36 foreign languages now so it does get her out [Music] do you struggle to fall asleep maybe you find yourself getting more and more headaches the problem could be coming from your technology many studies have shown that exposure to artificial blue light can disrupt sleeping patterns increase headaches and can even contribute to increased levels of stress and anxiety by raising cortisol but don’t worry there is a solution reblogs glasses do blocks is the only company that offers blue light filtering dangers backed by the latest science they also had the largest selection of frames to choose from and they are the only company that can take your own frames and turn them into blue blocks glasses I love my blue blocks glasses and I wear them every day they have been specially helpful as I work on my new book late at night on my computer and just for my listeners blue box is offering a 15 percent off discount with the code leaf L EAS at checkout the link and details will be in the show notes ok so carry on explaining about the longevity paradox you were explaining about the people dying younger how they trained is reversed over the last few years yeah so you know I think the longevity paradox is just is a guide to ok how do you die young at a ripe old age and the tricks I think are easier than some people realize let me just give one kind of fun example we know that women who exercise regularly will delay the onset of Alzheimer’s disease by 11 years if they are prone to Alzheimer’s disease women believe or not get more Alzheimer’s disease and which surprises most women but women who exercise regularly ninety percent of them will never develop Alzheimer’s and if they develop Alzheimer’s the Alzheimer’s worker eleven years later than if they didn’t have sir sighs regularly that’s incredible oh it would be one thing to develop Alzheimer’s at say 80 but quite another at 91 imagine what kind of time that gives you you know if we had a drug that was preventative of Alzheimer’s in you know ninety percent of people you know how much would we pay for that no exactly mm-hmm but I actually write prescriptions in my office for people to go get a dog hmm I believe it or not a dog makes you go exercise twice a day with you or not please some of my patients actually returned with the prescription framed as the best prescription a doctor ever gave them I love this I mean there’s another trick a paper out of Singapore last year looked at the effect of eating two cups of mushrooms a week on reducing dementia by 80% just two cups of mushrooms amazing even have to be special wild ones are gonna button mushrooms will actually do it for you oh that’s incredible could you maybe just give one more tip yeah I think the other really big tip is time restricted feeding now some people call this intermittent fasting but intermittent fasting is is a there’s a good technique but it’s totally different than time restricted feeding and time restricted feeding literally limits the amount of time that during the day that you are engaging in eating and taking in calories and I talked about in the book that some really exciting new research in brain research shows that we clean our brains out every night our brain undergoes a wash cycle where toxins and abnormal proteins like amyloid beta and tau proteins are literally washed out of your mmm and that wash cycle occurs quite early in the sleep cycle it occurs during deep sleep now REM sleep and if you eat near the time you go to bed all of your blood flow is actually taken down to your intestines for digestion and you don’t have enough blood flow to drive the brain wash cycle and so dr.

Dale bredesen and my colleague who wrote the end of Alzheimer’s and I really urge people to stop eating three to four hours before bedtime fascinating mm-hmm and to also have hopefully a 14 to 16 hour window every day of not eating and the good news is if you get eight hours of sleep your that counts as your thoughts ready and so the more we can compress that window of eating you’re going to actually supercharged turbocharged the mitochondria in your cells they’ll become incredibly efficient and all the evidence points to the fact that the more efficient we make our mitochondria the longer you’re going to live and the longer you’re going to live well mm-hmm just the key that’s what we all want to do that’s the key but I want to just relate that for a moment back to just people’s general medical health and I’m not talking mental health in the standard way that they talk about it today my field of research is in the mind-body connection and mental health from a perspective of it’s not a disease it’s basically normal to be said that presentation yes he goes just as you have tremors and whatever but it’s very much related to the things you saying how are we eating our lifestyle and you know the whole base of the spend everything you’ve been speaking about people dying younger they trekking back to lifestyle diseases which is really what you’re telling us is that we’ve really got to be proactive from young in how we are going to decisions about things like sleeping eating etc which of my own decisions you know and so hearing you say all these things is very inspiring to me into the research that I do as well can you just talk a little bit about how you see maker health and just the impact with your patients in change where you change their diet do you see a change in how they’ve ng the anxiety and the depression and you know the stuff that all of us go through well you know I think with every passing week a new paper comes out about the gut brain connection that got brain access and more importantly we used to think that so many of the neuro active hormones were made in the gut but now we’re realizing that most of them are actually made by the microbiome by gut bacteria and so much of anxiety and depression which of course as you and I both know is just skyrocketed over the last 50 years I think we can actually lay this at the feet of an altered microbiome and certainly in my patients a large number of them come with anxiety and depression and often on multiple medications and part of my job is restoring their gut microbiome to a point where for the most part knock on wood we can wean the em off of their antidepressants sometimes we have to use a tiny amount but most the time we can get them off and that’s so exciting that people have the ability to do this that it’s not their fate that somehow they inherited this there’s nothing they can do about it mmm-hmm take those awful drugs that actually destroy the GI system anyway yes that’s exactly right and there’s more and more evidence that these drugs alter the microbiome for the worse exactly and increase the potential for dementia I’m sure you see many even the long-term effect of acid reducing drugs proton pump inhibitors on dementia is scary Gary hmm which I talk about in all my books there’s a really good study that I really urge everybody to read and it’s easy to look up on the internet it’s called the Appleton Wisconsin middle school study if people just type that in Appleton Wisconsin in a lovely little town in middle of Wisconsin had a issue in middle schools typical issue in middle school bad behavior bad grades a lot of trips to the vice principal’s office a lot of truancy and they actually partnered with a organic cafe in town to feed breakfast and lunch at the school and then they taught the parents how they’d like them to you know feed the kids at home as much as possible and they tracked truancy they tracked behavior they track scores and tests and low and all truancy dropped behavior improved scores went up and they were so excited that they said well we can’t just ask this cafe to keep doing this we should kind of institutionalize this and we’ll find a provider to do this and they hired a company and I won’t mention the name but you’ll probably see them in airports to provide food services and as soon as a major corporation began providing the food services lo and behold everything went back to baseline I I tell you I I know that study I know this I have trained in schools one of the things I do train teachers are trained physicians and that kind of thing as well and this eating thing in schools and I’ve sometimes feel like I’m bashing my head against a brick wall where you walk around the school you see what these children are being fed and then you explain what this is doing and they carry on feeding them the same food it’s just it’s a mystery but as you say the mystery is not really a mystery it’s financially drew yeah and it’s so for instance and you know I know these studies you can take a family and put them on organic food for three weeks and you can see that their levels of pesticides and heavy metals and organo pollutants actually drop dramatically I’m out in there and urine in just three weeks yeah Andrea and they mental health you find the relationships improves a B C changes in the brain I put using key G’s you to see changes in behavior in managing anxiety it’s a changes so maybe you make a political comment maybe we should put all of our congressional people on these sorts of diets and this Bishop for the current the current I think it’s I exactly and I think it’s a prescription from a doctor you should give that prescription it’s very before we continue with today’s episode I want to tell you about a pair of shoes that have changed my life from Rafi’s I love my white sneakers and I wear them everywhere they’re not only very comfortable but they look great with everything I might just wear these on stage and all my speaking events from now on plus I love both his commitment to sustainability each pair of shoes is made out of recycled plastic water bottles and they fully machine washable need more convincing Rafi’s always comes with free shipping and free returns and exchanges no risk no worries no reason not to try check out all the amazing styles available right now at Rocky’s comm /dr leaf go to roth is calm our o th why is calm /dr leaf to get your new favorite flats these are the shoes that you have been waiting for here charities calm / the to leaf today yeah so I take care of a lot of children and teenagers originally with autoimmune diseases and their some of those challenging to try and keep them on this program but it’s worth it for them to get off of all the medications that they are on plus I have two grandchildren or pretty in five years old and my oldest daughter it was her she and her husband have my grandchildren I said you know we’re sold we’ve both lost 60 pounds on your program and but we want to you know make it easy for our kids you know how do we feed our kids you know we both work how do you do this and so I had so many requests that we put together this new plant paradox family cookbook most of the recipes use an instant pot or pressure cooker or a sheet pan they come together incredibly quickly and it’s funny the feedback since we released it in November is that everybody says number one these are your best recipes yet and they are so easy and at least my grandkids think that okay these are the best yet so and that’s what I wanted to do I wanted working families we’re all you know everybody’s working two or three jobs and we’re trying to get our kids you know two 14 soccer practices and school activities and it’s so easy to slip in the trap of oh heck on the way home I’ll grab a pizza or I’ll grab tacos or a bucket of chicken and you know I’m just too exhausted but again we set the stage for our kids not performing well for us not performing well to be exhausted all the time and to be anxious and depressed all the time and it’s there’s a better way and so I wanted to try to make this accessible and so far so good that’s wonderful so you talked about sitting up healthy habits for children that they can continue to adulthood would you mind just maybe giving just one or two examples and I know you’ve mentioned it’s easy if you get the kids involved but you have one or two examples to show people how important this book is to help teach your children to become healthy adults and it starts with children toddlers should say kids aren’t born with innate taste preferences for instance Japanese child is not born wanting to eat seaweed for an example and our children are not born wanting to have macaroni cheese and chicken nuggets for you know every meal hmm we teach them these things and we can teach them other things and even in the book what I suggest let’s suppose you’ve got kids of a thinking age and we’ll define that as maybe three and above let them make a decision about one thing that they’re going to throw out of the pantry and let it be a mutual family decision maybe it’s bread maybe it’s Kraft macaroni and cheese maybe it’s cow yogurt but make them have a decision in it and give them a little power over all this and then once that you know has been done then what I like to do years ago a good friend of mine Jimmy Schmidt who’s won three James Beard Awards so what we’re really trying to do is have food you love but that loves you back and so mmm I try to create recipes that taste like the foods you love look like the foods you love but lack lectins or lectins have been taken care of by pressure cooking and so that it now is going to nourish you rather than do you in and it’s so important as a children’s heart surgeon I can tell you that I could operate on an eight or ten year old child for congenital heart disease and already see plaques in the main blood vessels of these kids already and so we’ve yeah we’ve got a set stage early and the sooner you do this the more you’re going to give your kids just a phenomenal life and you know all of us brought kids into the world with the idea that we wanted them to have a great life right mmm exactly yeah why wouldn’t we set them up for the best exactly and you think you see people feeding you know when I go to these places wherever I’m littering or whatever and I see them feeding themselves and their children this junky modern American diet and I think you know you wouldn’t give your child heroin and cocaine but you know you’re giving them the modern American diet and they’re not that different you know it’s in terms of what its gonna do to your brain and your body you know and I’m sure you’re familiar with the Manila bio cheese well we know that the modern American diet is just the food industry is unregulated and meymaneh laboratories where they do the Bliss point studies children as young as four I mean it’s shocking I read in a book once thinking eat yourself smart we are address the issues you know some very similar issues towards you addressing but just from a different more mental health angle and I talked about that and most people haven’t heard about that don’t realize that our kids are being used to find the point at which your hormone systems can be damaged and your brain can be damaged so that you’ll eat more jungseok a you know sicker and in this world kids are growing up 150 60 years ago as you also see this was not the case so as adults we have to take the lead on this and really teach our children we have a responsibility yep it starts with each individual we this will not change from the top down the government is not going to tell us to change pharmaceutical companies are not going to change I’ll give you an example kind of just now been I think 10 years I was approached by some manufacturer at a major Midwestern city to come in and set up a health eating program in the with these manufacturers and I said well gosh you know you’ve got a great Medical School in your town you’ve got a great hospital system in your town you know what’s silly to have me do this why don’t you work with them and they say oh we tried and you know we had a big meeting and said here’s what we want and you know we want to partner with you and they said you got this all wrong you know we’re not in the wellness business we’re in the sickness business oh my god yeah and I went well least they were honest gosh that’s the only good thing that came out of that statement was at least they were honest but isn’t that honesty scary yeah yeah we call these you know health centers and they’re not health centers their sickness centers exactly exactly the not in disease prevention mean disease well they’re in disease management it’s terrible well that’s scary it’s like tell patient who’s a diabetic if you came in say with pneumonia and you know I’ll I’ll give you an antibiotic get rid of your pneumonia I certainly would not say well you have pneumonia and I’m going to help manage your pneumonia for the rest of your life and you know a patient would go what are you crazy I want you to get rid of this why can’t you teach me how to get rid of this and yet to this day so many of my diabetic patients are told that we’re gonna manage this you can’t get rid of diabetes and it’s like no fool me but this is you know we’re gonna make an ad that’s what they sang with with me you feel depressed or sad or so it’s some kind of illness me well that’s just a signal that there’s actually something going on that you need to address maybe it’s the socio-economic situation the political situation a child being bullied and you know so it’s just another way of diagnosing labeling and medicating I love you analogy but it’s so true I mean that’s brilliant executed I have to have you back on the show again because you’re just so so fascinating and has so much wisdom but be our times almost up and I’d want to be respectful of your time in your busy schedule so I just wanted to end up with two quick questions what are some health and wellness feds you’re most concerned about and something maybe you’re excited about the carnivore diet is reared its head again and I love it when people take a diet and rename it and try to make it sexy people should give credit where just do the carnivore diet is the Adkins diet and before him it was actually the drinking man’s diet Britain yeah it was called the drinking man’s diet it’s interesting but these you know ultra high protein diets come and go they do produce weight loss I wrote about it in my first book years ago but the long-term consequences are not good there’s a recent paper that I tweeted about a couple days ago that these carnivore diets produce unstable plaque in arteries compared to another form of diet so we just got to be careful feds yeah for sure and the other fad I take care of large numbers of vegans and vegetarians and I I my wife and I eat primarily a vegan diet during the week and then we had shellfish primarily on the weekend wild shellfish but so many of my patients with autoimmune diseases are vegans or vegetarians and you gotta know which plants like you and which plants don’t like you so I am a plant predator if anyone’s ever eaten they know you know I will devour plants but I choose my friends among the plant world so interesting I love the way you explain this so for instance you know the new meat alternative burgers both of them test positive for roundup glyphosate terrible why any of us who would want to be munching a burger that contains glyphosate in the name of eating plant centric just yeah boggles my mind brothers mine too yeah I agree with you I’m so glad you brought that up Wow well we can people find out more about you because I know you’ve picked so much interest and your books and your work and obviously we’ll put everything in the show notes as well so they can go to dr.

Gundry calm or Gundry MD calm I’ve got Instagram pages Facebook pages I have podcast dr. Gundry podcast hopefully I weigh to your listeners from their computer or several times a day on the internet and click it sometimes I also now have the longevity paradox of public television special that’s just released in December and thankfully it’s getting rave reviews and it’s a it’s a good view wonderful that’s fantastic will congratulations for that and all your incredible work and coming from the patient’s perspective and from the perspective that you have of helping us to you know the fight against this terrible sort of modern American diet and and decease to patient I think it’s just a doctor’s listening to the patient this is wonderful so thank you for your wisdom and it would be wonderful to interview again sometime and get some more with soprano thank you for your time you’ve been amazing thank you so much for much having me on the show today and Carole it’s great to chat with you I’ve enjoyed chatting with you too thank you I hope you found today’s podcast interesting and helpful if you want more tips and help with managing anxiety depression and mental health be sure to visit my website at dr.

Leif comm and you sign up for my weekly newsletter where I also include a schedule of my speaking events and so much more and follow me on social media I’m on Twitter Facebook and Instagram just look for dr. Caroline leaf also I love seeing all your posts on social media about this podcast I love seeing what resonates with you and what you’ve learned so be sure to continue posting and tagging me and letting me know what you think and how these tips worked out for you and don’t forget leave a review and keep spreading the word about this podcast thank you for joining me today I really hope you learned something new and helpful till then I’m dr. Caroline leaf this podcast represents the opinions of myself and my guests the content here should not be taken as medical advice the content here is for educational and informational purposes only please consult your healthcare professional for any individual medical questions you may have while we make every effort to ensure that the information we are sharing is accurate we welcome any comments suggestions or Corrections of errors

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